Thursday, July 3, 2014

TSA Week in Review – Samurai Sword, Stun Cane, 33 Firearms, and More

Due to the Fourth of July holiday, this report is being posted on Thursday vs. Friday and only reflects the last six days (6/27 - 7/2). 

M-1000 fireworks discovered in carry-on bag at MDW.
M-1000 fireworks discovered in carry-on bag at MDW.

Samurai sword discovered in a carry on bag a BOS.
Samurai sword discovered in a carry on bag at BOS.
Loaded firearms discovered in a carry on bag at PBI.
Loaded firearm discovered in a carry on bag at PBI.
33 Firearms Discovered This Week – Of the 33 firearms, 25 were loaded and eight had rounds chambered. 

Artfully Concealed Prohibited Items – It’s important to examine your bags prior to traveling to ensure prohibited items are not inside. If a prohibited item is discovered in your bag or on your body, you could be cited and possibly arrested by local law enforcement. Here are a few examples from this week where prohibited items were found by our officers in strange places. 
  • Credit Card Knives - 38 credit card knives were discovered this week. 10 were discovered at San Francisco (SFO), four at Providence (PVD), three at Nashville (BNA), three at Tampa (TPA), two at Beaumont (BPT), two at Grand Rapids (GRR), two at Shreveport (GRR), and the remainder were discovered at Billings (BIL), Bismarck (BIS), Cincinnati (CVG),  Colorado Springs (COS), Knoxville (TYS), Minneapolis (MSP), Muskegon (MKG), Philadelphia (PHL), Rochester (RST), St. Cloud (STC), St. Croix (STX), and Williston (ISN). Check out this blog post for more information on credit card knives.
  • A knife and a multi-tool with a knife were found concealed in a coffee cup at the Fairbanks (FAI) airport.
  • A hair brush dagger was discovered at the San Francisco (SFO) airport. 
  • A stun cane was discovered at the airport checkpoint in Tampa (TPA).
Stun Cane (TPA) - Brush Dagger (SFO)
Stun Cane (TPA) - Brush Dagger (SFO)
Miscellaneous Prohibited Items In addition to all of the other prohibited items we find weekly, our officers also regularly find firearm components, realistic replica firearms, bb and pellet guns, airsoft guns, brass knuckles, ammunition, batons and a lot of sharp pointy things…

Sword discovered in carry-on bag at CMH.
Sword discovered in carry-on bag at CMH.
Octagonal sais (top) and shukos (bottom) discovered at MDW.
Octagonal sais (top) and shukos (bottom) discovered at MDW.
Inert Ordnance and Grenades etc. – We continue to find inert grenades and other weaponry on a weekly basis. Please keep in mind that if an item looks like a real bomb, grenade, mine, etc., it is prohibited. When these items are found at a checkpoint or in checked baggage, they can cause significant delays because the explosives detection professionals must resolve the alarm to determine the level of threat. Even if they are novelty items, you cannot bring them on a plane.  Read here on why inert items cause problems.
  • Two inert grenades were discovered in carry-on bags this week at the New York Kennedy (JFK) and Savannah (SAV) airports.
Stun Guns – 12 stun guns were discovered this week in carry-on bags around the nation: Four were discovered at Denver (DEN), two at San Francisco (SFO), and the remainder were discovered at Chicago O'Hare (ORD), Dallas Love (DAL), Greenville-Spartanburg (GSP), Jacksonville (JAX), Lawton (LAW), Orlando (MCO), Portland (PWM), Sacramento (SMF), and Springfield (SGF). 
Airsoft gun discovered in carry-on bag at BHM.
Airsoft gun discovered in carry-on bag at BHM.
Airsoft Guns – Two Airsoft guns were discovered this week in carry-on bags at the Phoenix-Mesa (IWA), and Birmingham (BHM) airports. Airsoft guns are prohibited in carry-on bags, but allowed in checked baggage. Airsoft grenades are not permitted in checked or carry-on bags. Read this post for more information: TSA Travel Tips Tuesday: Traveling with Airsoft Guns

Ammunition discovered in carry-on bag at FSD.
Ammunition discovered in carry-on bag at FSD.
Ammunition – When packed properly, ammunition can be transported in your checked baggage, but it is never permissible to pack ammo in your carry-on bag.

Firearms discovered at: (T/B - L/R) MEM, PDX, AEX, DEN, SMF, TUL
Firearms discovered at: (T/B - L/R) MEM, PDX, AEX, DEN, SMF, TUL

33 Firearms Discovered This Week – Of the 33 firearms, 25 were loaded and eight had rounds chambered.
*In order to provide a timely weekly update, this data is compiled from a preliminary report. The year-end numbers will vary slightly from what is reported in the weekly updates. However, any monthly, midyear or end-of-year numbers TSA provides on this blog or elsewhere will be actual numbers and not estimates.

You can travel with your firearms in checked baggage, but they must first be declared to the airline. You can go here for more details on how to properly travel with your firearms. Firearm possession laws vary by state and locality. Travelers should familiarize themselves with state and local firearm laws for each point of travel prior to departure.

Unfortunately these sorts of occurrences are all too frequent which is why we talk about these finds. Sure, it’s great to share the things that our officers are finding, but at the same time, each time we find a dangerous item, the line is slowed down and a passenger that likely had no ill intent ends up with a citation or in some cases is even arrested. The passenger can face a penalty as high as $7,500. This is a friendly reminder to please leave these items at home. Just because we find a prohibited item on an individual does not mean they had bad intentions, that's for the law enforcement officer to decide. In many cases, people simply forgot they had these items.

If you haven’t seen it yet, make sure you check out our TSA Blog Year in Review for 2013. You can also check out 2011 & 2012 as well.

Follow @TSABlogTeam on Twitter and Instagram!


If you have a travel related issue or question that needs an immediate answer, you can contact us by clicking here.

42 comments:

RHB said...

I fly a lot. Really don't want someone sitting next to me with a loaded pistol or a Samuri sword. Thanks Guys! We apprecite your work.

Anonymous said...

Happy 4th of July, TSA! Don't let the other comments get you down. Just because they had to throw away their coffee and have anger issues doesn't mean you aren't doing a good job. Keep up the good work!

Anonymous said...

With all the weapons reported found each week, one wonders how many are not found. This is extremely disconcerting.

Anonymous said...

How can this keep happening week after week??? Trying to sneek some weird knife is one thing, but loaded firearms??

Anonymous said...

Thank you guys for keeping america safe..... what do you do with all the stuff you take from people?

Anonymous said...

My, my, the first 5 and so far only comments posted are in praise of the TSA - well, maybe 4.5. How many comments were censored in order to post these 4.5?

screen shot

John Smythe said...

Once again, no threats to aviation were found, and none of the found "against the rules" (not all are illegal) items could have been (were?) found with baggage xray and walk through metal detectors.

No naked pic scanners needed. Get rid of them and the sexual assault "patdowns" too. Pull the effective and low cost handheld detectors out of that Dallas warehouse where you keep millions of dollars of unused and ineffective equipment and start treating us like people, not prisoners.

Anonymous said...

Every week I read the information you share and I am grateful and amazed. Grateful you keep finding this stuff. Amazed that people are that stupid or arrogant as to try to get weapons on board. Keep it up - I fly a lot and absolutely appreciate you keeping weapons off aircraft.

Anonymous said...

It would be nice to sense that we can be treated like people, however, the reality is that it only takes one person with ill intent to create chaos and potentially kill many of us "people". The problem is no one know the ill intent person except that person and the risk level is just too high. Yes, it is inconvenient at times but that is the reality of living in a world where not everyone's mind is stable or their intent noble!!

Anonymous said...

Week after week we see these. What are these people thinking? You just can't fix stupid!

RB said...

So why does TSA brag about doing the most basic part of the TSA screening function?

What are current Red Team test results? Still missing 70% of target items?

Anonymous said...

I hate flying out of SFO, WHY? Because they are the only TSA agents that ask you what your name is, come on people, I gave you my boarding pass and my picture ID, with my name printed on both items
, so why should I have to verbally give you my name. Just stupid, and I am a TSA pre-check passenger....

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
With all the weapons reported found each week, one wonders how many are not found. This is extremely disconcerting.
---------------------------------
not sure why it is disconcerting. you've almost certainly flown in the presence of one of the 70% of prohibited items missed by the TSA, and you've never been shot, stabbed, hijacked, or terrorized. this is nothing but theater.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
I hate flying out of SFO, WHY? Because they are the only TSA agents that ask you what your name is, come on people, I gave you my boarding pass and my picture ID, with my name printed on both items
, so why should I have to verbally give you my name. Just stupid, and I am a TSA pre-check passenger....
----------------------------------
you are not required to answer. I never reply to TSA, not even when they say good morning.

Anonymous said...

John--we don't know what was legal or illegal without the specifics from law enforcement, which really isn't possible for TSA to do without waiting several months to report what happened. For example, a legal pistol in the hands of a felon becomes illegal. Another example--It's illegal to conceal carry in Illinois airports, so a legal pistol becomes an illegal action when carried in the airport. There just isn't enough info in the blog to determine. RB--you keep using the 70% number. The fact that it's so exact tells me that it's not scientific anyway. Where did you get that number from (source) and how old is it? A certain number of surgeries are botched each year. Do we stop doing all surgeries because of the possible failure rate? Absolutely not. Use the blog wisely--forward it to all the people you know who have firearms so they responsibly transport their firearms while travelling. I personally would like to keep my firearms and I don't want these incidents used as an argument for taking them away.

Anonymous said...

Another week, another total lack of anything that needed your slow, invasive, and dangerous naked body scanners to be detected.

Now tell us, how many false positives did the naked body scanners have last week? How many innocent people were "patted down" by your screeners because the naked body scanners can't differentiate between, say, a firearm and pleats?

/screenshot

SSSS for Some Reason said...

"...Anonymous said...
With all the weapons reported found each week, one wonders how many are not found. This is extremely disconcerting."

Why?

All those not found weapons did no harm to anyone and remained not found.

Having something the TSA considers a prohibited item does not mean you are a bad guy intent on destruction or harm. A point which is clearly proven by the fact all those prohibited items that were not found were not used to commit harm to passengers or aircraft.

Anonymous said...

I continue to wait for some justification for active duty military being included in pre-check, but not retired military or holders of current DoD or LE background investigations. military retirees have at least 20 years documented service to this Nation, pretty much proving their lack of risk. both DoD and LE background investigations should reveal any risk factors. active duty military do not, necessarily, have a background check or any significant length of service. neither citizenship nor a background investigation is required to enlist in the military, in fact there are likely illegal immigrants serving. if it is really about safety, then why are potentially unscreened non-citizens allowed through? sounds like it is just pandering to an admirable group to get PR, not adjusting the rules to ease screening on those who present a lower likelihood of threat.
Let me be clear: pre-911 screening should be the norm. it is all that is required, now that cockpit doors have been reinforced and locked, and flight crews and passengers know that the rules have changed and passivity=death. however, if we are going to continue this massive waste of tax dollars on security theatre, at least have _some_ of the rules make sense.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
I hate flying out of SFO, WHY? Because they are the only TSA agents that ask you what your name is, come on people, I gave you my boarding pass and my picture ID, with my name printed on both items
, so why should I have to verbally give you my name. Just stupid, and I am a TSA pre-check passenger....

July 6, 2014 at 10:11 PM
_________________________________

SFO uses a private screening company. They follow TSA guidelines, but any extra things they add are on them.

RB said...

Anonymous said...

snipped......
RB--you keep using the 70% number. The fact that it's so exact tells me that it's not scientific anyway. Where did you get that number from (source) and how old is it? A certain number of surgeries are botched each year. Do we stop doing all surgeries because of the possible failure rate? Absolutely not. ...Snipped

July 7, 2014 at 9:26 AM

The Red Team Test data that is in the public domain is getting a bit old, but that is only because TSA is afraid to let the public know exactly how bad they really do.

The 70% number has been talked about here on the blog, national media sources, Congress and other places.

I will leave it up to you to do your own research. But for a little helping hand I will leave you with this:

http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2011/01/tsa_threat_detection


There's definitely some confusion here. The ABC News report Gulliver linked to last month didn't rely on 2004, 2005, or 2006 numbers—it referenced "a person briefed" on "the latest tests" who said they have a failure rate of 70%. And earlier in December, TSA administrator John Pistole told the press that some airports let every test gun, knife, and bomb part through. Here's a key excerpt from another ABC News article:

"We've had a series of reports actually going back several years from the inspector general, from the General Accounting Office, and our own TSA Office of Inspection, where they do, as you describe, covert testing," Pistole acknowledged to George Stephanopoulos last month during an interview on Good Morning America. "And unfortunately, [undercover testers] have been very successful over the years."

John Smythe said...

To the TSAnonymous who replied to me: I never said the TSA can or should determine whether a found weapon was legal or not. I mention the legality because some commenters here think everyone who ever carried a weapon (from a pocketknife to a gun) into an airport should be thrown in jail, without any regard to actual laws.

As for the 70% number RB and others use, it is from the TSA itself. I'm surprised your bosses haven't shared that information with you.

Your crack screeners missed 70% of the Red Team test runs. Since that huge failure rate was revealed several years ago, the TSA has refused to publicly share any results since, but they had to share it with other govt agencies and Congress, who told the taxpayers that the TSA hasn't improved their test rates, so 70% is both accurate and current.

Unless TSA wants to share more current and better results? Blotter Team, can you ask your boss if you can share a actual fact?

Susan Richart said...

You can bet that if the 70% rate had decreased, we would be hearing about it. I would be willing to wager that the rate has increased over the years.

I believe one purpose of the weekly report of found items is to deflect attention away from those items that are not found.

BTW, where is the report on the WBI false alarm rate that the GAO has requested?

screen shot/DHS OIG statement

Anonymous said...

So the general rule here is that if you disagree with someone who dislikes the TSA, then you must work for the TSA?

RB said...

I didn't think TSA screeners could legally confiscate anything.

Seems I was wrong.

TSA Says Growing Number Of Passengers Stopped With ‘Credit Card’ Knives


"TSA spokesperson Laurie Dankers said San Francisco International Airport topped the list of credit cardknives found on passengers. According to her statistics, 20 of the knives were found this year at SFO; 19 were confiscated at Oakland’s airport.

Across the country, the TSA has confiscated more than 500 of these knives."


So what's the deal TSA? Are your screeners now violating the law by confiscating things?

Anonymous said...

Keep up the great work TSA!!!

*Screenshot

TSORon said...

Anonymous said...
[[I hate flying out of SFO, WHY? Because they are the only TSA agents that ask you what your name is]]

Technically, the screeners at SFO are not TSA employee’s. SFO was one of the 5 original airports allowed to use contractors to fulfill the TSA requirements for screening. Others include Kansas City International, Jackson Hole Wyoming, and I believe Santa Rosa California. Those contractors must meet the same training and qualification requirements as actual TSA screeners, but they are not “government” employee’s.

Anonymous said...

"A certain number of surgeries are botched each year. Do we stop doing all surgeries because of the possible failure rate?"

You are not weighing costs against benefits. Try comparing letting a gun on board a plane to letting someone die of a heart attack.

SSSS for Some Reason said...

"... Anonymous said...
"A certain number of surgeries are botched each year. Do we stop doing all surgeries because of the possible failure rate?"

You are not weighing costs against benefits. Try comparing letting a gun on board a plane to letting someone die of a heart attack."

The Air Marshalls carry a gun on board a plane. And there have been several reported instances where firearms were missed in the screening process allowing passengers with guns on board a plane. Put very simply, having a gun does not make you a bag guy.

And most Cabin Crew are trained in at least basic first-aid, and many have advanced life-saving technique training. While they may not be able to save a heart-attack victim, the can at least make the attempt to save a life.

So, no, your question about comparing one to the other is inaccurate and quite plainly silly.

RB said...

The court mandated Notice of Proposed Rule Making for the Strip Search Machines closed on 6/25/2013, and here a full year plus later TSA still has not released the results of that process.

We already know that the vast majority of comments were in opposition to the TSA Electronic Strip Search machines.

The only question remaining is if TSA will ignore the public's input and violate the public's trust again or comply with the public's direction to remove these devices from our airports?

What's the hold up TSA?

John Smythe said...

Anonymous said...

So the general rule here is that if you disagree with someone who dislikes the TSA, then you must work for the TSA?

July 8, 2014 at 8:18 AM


Not always, Anonymous, but it is clear that TSA employees or their friends/family do post anonymously here. (They will use the pronoun "we" when talking about TSA employees, etc.) These people are sometimes referred to as "TSAnonymous." I've only seen a couple of Anonymous TSA Promoters deny they work for dept.

Anonymous said...

two at Grand Rapids (GRR), two at Shreveport (GRR),
____________

How many passengers arrive in the wrong state?

GSOLTSO said...

RHB sez - "Thanks Guys! We apprecite your work."

You are quite welcome!

Anon sez - "Happy 4th of July, TSA! Don't let the other comments get you down."

Happy 4th to you as well, and we don't let the comments get us down.

Anon sez - "Thank you guys for keeping america safe..... what do you do with all the stuff you take from people?"

You are welcome! Each airport disposes of items that people voluntarily surrender in the same basic way (although many airports have small differences in how they handle it). Most contract out and sell the items either through GSA Auctions, or through a local source.

Anon sez - "Keep it up - I fly a lot and absolutely appreciate you keeping weapons off aircraft."

We appreciate the nice comments, and we will be here!

Anon sez - "Keep up the great work TSA!!!"

Thank you, and we will do our best.

Anon sez - "How many passengers arrive in the wrong state?"

You would be surprised how often this actually happens. A passenger new to the reservation systems or computers (and yes, there are tons of people out there that are not very experienced with computers) make a reservation from their local airport to a city only to find out that they have landed in a city with the same name in a completely different state than they intended! Luckily for the majority of passengers, this does not happen, but it does happen on occasion.

West
TSA Blog Team

RB said...

GSOLTSO said...
RHB sez - "Thanks Guys! We apprecite your work."

You are quite welcome!

Anon sez - "Happy 4th of July, TSA! Don't let the other comments get you down."

Happy 4th to you as well, and we don't let the comments get us down.

Anon sez - "Thank you guys for keeping america safe..... what do you do with all the stuff you take from people?"

You are welcome! Each airport disposes of items that people voluntarily surrender in the same basic way (although many airports have small differences in how they handle it). Most contract out and sell the items either through GSA Auctions, or through a local source.

Anon sez - "Keep it up - I fly a lot and absolutely appreciate you keeping weapons off aircraft."

We appreciate the nice comments, and we will be here!

Anon sez - "Keep up the great work TSA!!!"

Thank you, and we will do our best.

Anon sez - "How many passengers arrive in the wrong state?"

You would be surprised how often this actually happens. A passenger new to the reservation systems or computers (and yes, there are tons of people out there that are not very experienced with computers) make a reservation from their local airport to a city only to find out that they have landed in a city with the same name in a completely different state than they intended! Luckily for the majority of passengers, this does not happen, but it does happen on occasion.

West
TSA Blog Team

July 10, 2014 at 5:01 AM

..................
So you guys can post comments but only when receiving complementary remarks.

When will TSA answer the Medical Nitroglycerin Pill questions that have been asked?

Don't repost the same old TSA Can I Bring nonsense since that does not address the question in any manner..

Mike Toreno said...

Clerk West, rather than respond to your own planted comments, why not provide some useful information? What are the rules on breast milk and what happens to clerks who violate the rules? What happened to the clerks who held Stacey Armato captive? Were they fired? What happens to blog team members who post comments while concealing the fact that they were planted, either directly or through the mediation of stooges? Are they fired?

Are there any standards of integrity for the TSA blog team?

Anonymous said...

People cannot "voluntarily surrender" their private property to a government actor when forced to do so under duress, West.

It's seizure and confiscation, as stated by TSA spokespersons.

"Enhanced patdown," like "enhanced interrogation" is abuse of people without due process or even a clear reason to do so.

"Enhanced patdown" is the touching of breasts, buttocks, and genitals, as well as sticking hands down the pants and groping of hair by a government actor on innocent people without any law enforcement power or reasonable suspicion that the person has committed a crime or even broken a civil rule.

"Enhanced patdowns" are used punitatively and retaliatorily against people who want to get on a plane with baby food, breast milk, underwire bras, skirts, piercings, medical devices, long hair, or natural African-American hair. Actually, this list can go on for several paragraphs, but I have things to do today.

The scanners generate a false positive (or negative!) reading over 50% of the time. Would any other govt dept use sensing equipment that fails over half the time? Probably, but does that cause govt actors to touch the breasts, buttocks, and genitals of innocent people wanting to do a legal act (travel in the US)?

(I'd give the medical term for the male and female genetalia, but I'm sure the Blotter Team would use science as a reason to censor this comment.)

*screen shot*

@skywaymanaz said...

Anon sez - "How many passengers arrive in the wrong state?"

This has never, nor should it ever be, a TSA responsibility. I can see how it would be a major problem if you accidentally buy a ticket to Columbus, GA instead of Columbus, OH. That's still between you and the airline even if you only realize the mistake on arrival. There are also cases where someone has a boarding pass to the correct city but somehow gets on the wrong flight. As awkward as that may be to discover you got on the flight to the wrong Springfield half way there the airline should have caught that at boarding, not TSA.

That said I know of a cases where TSA has refused to admit people past the checkpoint because it isn't the most logical way to their airline even though it is possible to get there from that checkpoint. My mother and my brother both had flights out of DFW one day and TSA refused to allow my brother thru the checkpoint for my mother's airline even though all airlines are reachable past each security checkpoint there. Fortunately both are frequent fliers but that could have gotten awkward with first timers. My brother just took the post security train back to my mother's gate anyway to see her off first before boarding his flight. Not sure what TSA accomplished there that benefited aviation security. Ignorance probably or a power trip or both.

RB said...

@skywaymanaz said...Anon sez - "How many passengers arrive in the wrong state?"This has never, nor should it ever be, a TSA responsibility. I can see how it would be a major problem if you accidentally buy a ticket to Columbus, GA instead of Columbus, OH. That's still between you and the airline even if you only realize the mistake on arrival. There are also cases where someone has a boarding pass to the correct city but somehow gets on the wrong flight. As awkward as that may be to discover you got on the flight to the wrong Springfield half way there the airline should have caught that at boarding, not TSA.That said I know of a cases where TSA has refused to admit people past the checkpoint because it isn't the most logical way to their airline even though it is possible to get there from that checkpoint. My mother and my brother both had flights out of DFW one day and TSA refused to allow my brother thru the checkpoint for my mother's airline even though all airlines are reachable past each security checkpoint there. Fortunately both are frequent fliers but that could have gotten awkward with first timers. My brother just took the post security train back to my mother's gate anyway to see her off first before boarding his flight. Not sure what TSA accomplished there that benefited aviation security. Ignorance probably or a power trip or both.July 13, 2014 at 8:15 AM
...........................................
With the new train service at DFW that will stop at only terminal A people may wish to use the Skylink service to move from terminal A to any other terminal. Of course the Skylink train is boarded after clearing security.

At DFW a traveler can clear security at any checkpoint and depart from any gate. Your experience indicates to me a lazy bunch of TSA screeners. Should have called for the TSM for that terminal.

@skywaymanaz said...

RB you're probably right about lazy. I wasn't there and it was several years ago so it's possible this issue has been addressed with them since. I never assume malice for what can easily be explained by incompetence but with TSA it often is hard to tell the difference.

Anonymous said...

"The problem is no one know the ill intent person except that person and the risk level is just too high."

What do you mean "too high"? Travelers are in far more danger driving on US roads than flying on US planes, yet millions drive US roads every day and the government does not ration cars, enact caps on vehicle-miles traveled, require ignition interlock devices in all cars, and such. It is more likely that someone will drown in their bath tub than die as a result of an act of terror, yet people continue to bathe and there are no government cameras monitoring bathers for the bathers' safety.

"Yes, it is inconvenient at times but that is the reality of living in a world where not everyone's mind is stable or their intent noble!!"

You encounter unstable people everywhere: the grocery store, the church, the library, the gym, the dentist's office, the hospital, the post office, the pharmacy, walking down the street, etc. Should everyone be groped or photographed naked before they enter such places? Should you need to get a background check before you can mail a package?

Anonymous said...

"So what's the deal TSA? Are your screeners now violating the law by confiscating things? "

What saddens me is not the job TSA does, its the complete ignorance of the traveling public.

Does TSA confiscate anything? NO
Things that are not "illegal" can be abandoned at the TSA checkpoint, returned to your car or put in your checked baggage.

Things that are illegal are reported to local law enforcement who then decides if it is "confiscated". Confiscated items are confiscated by law enforcment, NOT TSA.

Anonymous said...

"Let me be clear: pre-911 screening should be the norm. it is all that is required, now that cockpit doors have been reinforced and locked, and flight crews and passengers know that the rules have changed and passivity=death."

Ya, because that worked so well...
WOW...
Pre 9/11 not all bags were screened. Now, 100% of bags are screened.
Pre 9/11 no way to detect explosives on a passenger
Now, many different ways of detecting explosives..

There are many many ways to bring down an aircraft besides going into the cockpit.
To assume a hardened door makes all threats go away is absolutly redicilous. It only eliminates taking over the cockpit.

People ignorance to the real threat amazes me every day...

Wintermute said...

Anonymous said...
"Let me be clear: pre-911 screening should be the norm. it is all that is required, now that cockpit doors have been reinforced and locked, and flight crews and passengers know that the rules have changed and passivity=death."

Ya, because that worked so well...
WOW...


It wasn't the screening that was the problem. It was that crews and passengers were told to comply (not gonna happen these days) and cockpit doors were not secure. Those two changes alone are all that would have prevented the tragedy.

Pre 9/11 not all bags were screened. Now, 100% of bags are screened.

You are mistaken. Less than 100% of bags are screened.

Pre 9/11 no way to detect explosives on a passenger
Now, many different ways of detecting explosives..


But not reliably. There are so many false positives that the screeners would likely miss the real thing.

There are many many ways to bring down an aircraft besides going into the cockpit.

But that is the one that caused 9/11, and that's the apoligists excuse for the sorry state of affairs.

To assume a hardened door makes all threats go away is absolutly redicilous.

As is your spelling ;)

It only eliminates taking over the cockpit.

9/11

People ignorance to the real threat amazes me every day...

The treat is minimal. Show me a risk assessment that says otherwise.